Playing to loops in a live situation

[ebbz]

I've been checking out the Roland SPD-S sampler to use in my cover band. The SPD-S is a nice set-up that you can import samples that can be any length. In this situation you can layer shakers, cowbells, congas, or other sounds and add up to 8 layers(polyphony) and take away any of the above sounds, without having to stop the "whole" loop.
Has anyone checked this device out and/or other set-ups for similar use? If there are other ideas out there, please tell me any experiences....pros or cons!!

[Groovemeister]

I use a Roland SPD-S for smaller gigs and whole racks of Akai samplers and a D-Drum brain for the big stuff...

My opinion of the SPD-S is that it is a wonderful invention. Truely remarkable to have drum machine, drum kits, sequencing ability and sampling facility at that meagre price. The latency is pretty much non-existant and you can midi it up to any other device - especially good if you've got other brains and pads...

It truely is an exceptional piece of kit. Even now when I do covers gigs, the band are always floored by how much I've done my homework when they hear the sounds from the records coming from the drum chair. Things like that can get you called back for a gig as quick as a flash. Attention to detail man...

I say get it, and put yourself head and shoulders above the competition. Let me know how you get on...

MP

[Mazzhole]

The SPD-S doesn't have a sequencer in it does it? I have one and love it.. It would be great if it did.

[Jean-Paul]

That's my problem too, that it doesn't have a sequencer otherwise it would have been a top product and I could get rid of some other pieces of gear. Roland is always making a nearly perfect product, you miss always something, and the next year you can't update it anymore.

Is anyone working with a laptop with a sequencer and virtual sampler in it on stage? If yes, is it reliable?

[Dazzler]

I have been emailing Kaide about this product and he has been very helpful. I hope he doesn\t mind, but here are his responses to my questions about the SPD:

KAIDE:

So I hardly use any preset sounds (from the SPD) nowadays, instead I have loaded other sounds to the module from my sample libraries. You can save 900 sounds or loops to SPD-S. The bare machine has 187 preset sounds and the rest are empty sounds. SPD-S has very small internal memory but you can and should expand it by buying extra compact flash card (maximum size 512 mb). There you have over 3 hours of room for sounds and loops!

I normally do my loops with PC and program called ACID, normally I construct those from different sample libraries. And when I'm playing live I have Tama rhythm watch in my monitors so when it's time to hit the loop on, I'm sure that I will be in right tempo. I have measured Rhythm watch tempos and they aren't perfect, meaning if a tempo in a metronome would be 120, in reality it's about 119,993! So when I'm programming with ACID I write this 119,..... tempo to project tempo! Sounds difficult and complicated??

Other way without metronome would be panning click to left and a loop to right channel. Then you just take a left channel to your ears and the right channel for everybody else. That way you can also have good count-offs.

And more about SPD-S: It has 128 preset banks where you can save your sound collections and then you have filters which you can use to make your loops sound different.

I actually only use SPD-S as loop/FX machine at my gigs so I have only 10 patch banks to worry about. I don't use but YOU can any extra pads. I haven't measured the speed of bass drum triggering but it felt like it was coming a little behind?


Second question: Yes I usually just program one or two bar loops with Acid and then export those to SPD-S. But I also have few complete songs (percussion part/keys) in my pad. We released a CD year ago and I thought that it would nice to play with original loops! I hardly ever use pattern sequenser but I have tried it and it works if you play single hits and make groove of those. It's hard to play good sounding tambourine groove that way!! But you can use it with cabasas, congas, cowbells........
And when I use these one bar loops, I can always start and stop the loop hitting the same pad again. You can also layer maximum 4 loops together live but you need to be quite careful that they start exactly same time!! I use maximum three loops that way. Ex. Claps 2+4, conga-groove and last tambourine groove.

Next question: About exporting loop or sound: So that works with this compact flash card and reader. You just edit your loop with your computer, save it as 16bit wav or aif to compact flash card and then put the card inside SPD and use import function to get it there! SPD-S doesn't have USB or firewire connections, but it has midi connection.

Next: Percussion example: I play sometimes claps that way but usually I program those beforehand. You don't need a computer to make those quarter note cowbells and congas.

Next: "As far as the metronome goes, you use a Rhythm Watch, I have a Clickstation! So would you put your metronome into your mixer and have it only going into your headphones/monitor. Then the SPD going into your mixer, out to your phones/monitor and then also out to the front mix?" That's right and it's OK to have Clickstation, only exact tempos might be different so you'd have to record you metronome to computer in different speeds then measure it that way, it's a lot work but after that it's nice to play because your loops will stay exactly with the click!!!

Next: "What is the difference between doing it that way and splitting the loops/perc and metonome so they are in seperate ears? What is the benefit? Am I right in thinking with this method, you actually program a click in the SPD and set this off at the start and leave it running in one side of the phones, then trigger all your loops when ready and have them coming out of the front? Surely with this way, you won't be able to hear the loop/perc sounds in your phones?" Now you got it wrong, I take both channels through DI-boxes to mixer and then mix those through the mixer, I don't use the phones output from the SPD-S. So soundman can take the right mono channel to his mixing board and you use the left channel only for you and you can hear your loops from the right channel output!


....... I hope this adds to the conversation. I would also like to ask to what extent can you sequence whole tunes on the SPD? I know that the MPC is the guvnor, but as well as playing perc live on the big pads, how user friendly is it as far as making whole tunes with perc/loops coming in and out of different sections?

Can I aslo ask what and how you guys who have one of theese use it on live gigs? Do you have a click in your phones and then fire off loops? Do you use the perc on the pads as you are playing the kit? Can you take a click out of the SPD to your phones and then have everything out the front?

Sorry to be a pain, but electronics are something I have yet to explore and this product seems great for me... if only it would sequence! [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]redface.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ September 22, 2005 02:47 PM: Message edited by: Dazzler ]</font>

[kaide]

Hope I got all the details right?

By the way there is a "Phase maker" what you can use to create your own loops and then resample those. So that might be somekind of sequenser.

If you want to create few different loops for a different sections it's easy to change to next just by hitting pad one time. The previous one will stop and the new one will start from there.

And one important thing that is missing from SPD-S is: You can't have click from headphone output (like for example in TD-10). You only hear click when you are in recording mode.

[ebbz]

Dazzler......do you know if Roland will have a new up-dated version?? I was thinking it might be a good idea to wait and go to the Winter NAMM show and see if something new and improved will be coming out soon.

[Dazzler]

Ebbz - don't know as this isn't my bag really. I was hoping to get some info from Groovemeister! [img]wink.gif[/img]

[Groovemeister]

Hey ya'll!

Sorry for the delay in the reply, been too busy to fart!

When I said about the 'sequencing' ability, I use it as a sequencer in the respect that I'll load a chorus backing track (synths, another guitar, backing vocals etc...) into the machine and trigger it when needed. In that respect, it runs like a sequencer...

"Other way without metronome would be panning click to left and a loop to right channel. Then you just take a left channel to your ears and the right channel for everybody else. That way you can also have good count-offs." That's great advice, and just what I do...

As far as synching-up the click and the track, I use the on-board click on the SPD-S set to whatever speed the song is. Don't worry about the milisecond-per-minute (or something like that) latency - if you midi-synch it to something like the Yamaha Clickstation, it accounts for minute fluctuations...

As far as sequencingh is concerned, no, you'll not beat an MPC for the price...

I have spoken to Roland about an updated SPD-S, but by all accounts there are no plans. They said that sales on the SPD-S haven't been great... That amazed me...

Hope this clears some stuff up Dazz...

MP

[got_a_matchgrip]

Ugh no, I'd never be able to enjoy a click pan hard 2 1 side & the rest, the other. Ack.

Personal Mackie has all the instruments going in + click, all are mono but w capability of panning into the ears within board, so that you can get a sense of stereo mix effect overall from the stereo phones out. Or dead center. JMO. Outboard FX unit can help too. I realize we perhaps might be talking about budgetary expenditure here, so...I was just glad when i ended up eventually getting a decent rig set up. Plan ahead for it. [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]cool.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]